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 (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]

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s3rius

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PostSubject: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Sun 09 Aug 2009, 21:57

New ideas topic. Archived old one.
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PostSubject: Re: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Sun 09 Aug 2009, 22:07

Make the gargs a little weaker attack or hp wise. They arent really a problem, but if one person is alone for even a few seconds, the gargs will get them. Just a thought.
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PostSubject: Re: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Mon 10 Aug 2009, 00:53

What Burn said. Seriously gargs, taking on one alone can bring you down to half health or lower before you kill it. Even worse you make gargs come pretty early in the game now, which is really annoying and sometimes they come in swarms and it's GG for you. I think after the introduction of DotD B7 at least 60% of all my deaths were because of a garg or garg swarm. That's just too much.
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PostSubject: Re: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Mon 10 Aug 2009, 01:00

gargoyles should be a "surprise" attacker... coming from where you can't see at all: over the walls of the buildings...

they shouldn't have more health than a walking zombie Razz

....................
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PostSubject: Re: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Mon 10 Aug 2009, 01:22

[edit: I took so much time writing this post, there was only BC's post showing, so instead of changing it because I'm lazy, just keep in mind I wrote the beginning as if it followed BC]


Or if they team up, at nm level they can kill you before you even have time to fall back, use secondary or use medkits (which you don't always have) and since :

- In nm, your teammates are pretty much always busy
- Only the FB can tank some attacks/scout can go invisible

You're in a pretty tough position if you're alone against 2 gargs.

Yeah yeah, you should not put yourself in a position where you come up alone against 2 gargs, but since most people just run when there's too much heat you may effectively end up alone even if you have 4-5 teammates in your visual.

So, yeah, I think if there's any problem with gargs is attack dmg or attack speed, as they are relatively easy to kill when you team them up.

I've played demo once and well, I didn't like him so much. Ok, I sucked big times with him, killing myself twice (and once killing teammate as well), but it seems to me he's of no purpose other than against ground bosses.

=> The set up time of rockets absolutely requires flares to see incoming units, or you just fire randomly hoping some units will get hit when you fire it, the thing is: must units have time to get out of the AoE of anti-infantry within the 2sec set up time.

Maybe if the demo could create road flares (and like, many of them at once or a few cheaply) that would help.

=> binoculars and/or night vision googles: the binoculars could be a unlock, that would allow some high rank players to have a huge improvement in their sight range (removes fog of war), it could require the safety trigger and would be limited to a restraint angle of vision in front of the character (if that's possible), the night vision could be used pretty much the same way expect only scouting classes would have that and the effect is even better in the "lights out" mission

=> Medals: you plan to have them in the beta 8, so I won't do basic suggestions, but there's a few things I'd like to see with medals

1- If they could actually be useful for the gameplay and not just provide generic buffs, for instance if they could unlock some skills (active or passive) to be able to survive better the early game when going lonewolf, for e.g. a short range detection of zombies/ghouls (from the smell and sound, you could know ahead when an undead is just around the corner), if you could get some big critical damage against the weaker units => you've killed so many that you know their weak spot and became adept at hitting it. [ok, doesn't make sense with the storyline, but still...]

2- If acquiring medals would not be very linear. Here's what I mean about "linear", let's say you have a medals E through A in the same "category" they would have such requirements:

E = x kills and y hits
D = 2x kills and 0.8y hits
C = 2.5x kills and 0.6y hits
B = 3x kills and 0.5y hits
A = 3.5x kills and 0.4y hits

That's extremely linear....but I guess some medals NEED to be awarded with the kills and hits stats. It would just be nice to have class or action specific medals:

- Using a skill (or multiple skills) x amount of times throughout the game, that would grant you a [class] expertise medal

- Another version of that could be the number of skills used against a boss. Pretty much all classes have anti-boss specific skill (although I don't know much about the scout and assman...)

- There could be special mentions (and bonuses too) for special accomplishments. For e.g. let's say you get a Meritorious Unit Commendation for finishing the game in normal mode, you could have a "With Merit" mention indicating you did it without dying a single time.

Actually, some medals could just be there to state your accomplishments and could accumulat indefinately. Of course, that would open the door to abuse by farming those medals so they probably would not provide any bonus whatsoever, but that would be frustrating for players though... maybe: provide very little bonuses (like, +5HP or +1% damage), so that it's not worth farming them

Also, when dealing with a medal that can have many grades, you can simply add bars to that medal instead of having different medals. For e.g. I guess the medal of honor would be for finishing Hell or something. Your MoH with x bars would say you finished hell x+1 times!

- Having higher ranks award medals, I think it would had a fun twist if Generals could give out medals themselves to other players in the game upon completion. Something like Bronze stars or so...

By the way, I'd be willing to draft a complete medal awards and requirements if you want to take that off your hands...

Questions:

- Will the bank east of the river be accessible in b8?
- Is it even possible to survive so many raccoons?
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PostSubject: Re: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Mon 10 Aug 2009, 03:02

Yes, yes. The difficulty is a little higher than initially intended Wink
I will adjust that for the next beta.

SC2PL.Tamer wrote:

I've played demo once and well, I didn't like him so much. Ok, I sucked big times with him, killing myself twice (and once killing teammate as well), but it seems to me he's of no purpose other than against ground bosses.

=> The set up time of rockets absolutely requires flares to see incoming units, or you just fire randomly hoping some units will get hit when you fire it, the thing is: must units have time to get out of the AoE of anti-infantry within the 2sec set up time.

Maybe if the demo could create road flares (and like, many of them at once or a few cheaply) that would help.
Having an Engineer in the team helps a lot. He can net enemies long enough for the Demo to kill them with a rocket (optionally you can use Smokes, Disabling shot, Assman's net, Enfield, etc).
Scout or Advanced Marksman can reveal the area for the demo to quickly find his targets.
I want classes to have synergies with others. The Demo on his own is far less effective than in combination with a good team. Both Scout and Engineer have a hard time killing bosses, but when they use their abilities to spot and net, then the Demo can take a good chunk of any bosses hp with a single rocket.
The AI rocket has less firing delay and a greater AoE. It might be a better choice when you're alone or don't have the needed classes in your team. It's easier to hit stuff with it, but still strong enough to kill Whiteys/Dogs.
The Demo's bombs allow some nifty tricks, too.
E.g. the Satchels are a great creep-killer. If you're being followed, just drop one on the ground and shift-move on. Your hero will then drop a Satchel without stopping and you can blow it up right behind you. If you time it well it is strong enough to kill a gargoyle on NM.
When I'm Demo I usually solo the dogs-mission. A few times I've killed 3/5 dogs in the same time as the rest of the team needed to kill the other two.


SC2PL.Tamer wrote:

=> binoculars and/or night vision googles: the binoculars could be a unlock, that would allow some high rank players to have a huge improvement in their sight range (removes fog of war), it could require the safety trigger and would be limited to a restraint angle of vision in front of the character (if that's possible), the night vision could be used pretty much the same way expect only scouting classes would have that and the effect is even better in the "lights out" mission
You know, binoculars don't work very well during night ^.^
It might be too imba to have it as a unlock, but adding this sort of items could work.
The cone-like vision is tricky, but also possible.


SC2PL.Tamer wrote:

1- If they could actually be useful for the gameplay and not just provide generic buffs, for instance if they could unlock some skills (active or passive) to be able to survive better the early game when going lonewolf, for e.g. a short range detection of zombies/ghouls (from the smell and sound, you could know ahead when an undead is just around the corner), if you could get some big critical damage against the weaker units => you've killed so many that you know their weak spot and became adept at hitting it. [ok, doesn't make sense with the storyline, but still...]
I don't want medals to have too much of an impact. They're meant to indicate good players and the small stats bonuses are just like candy. Maybe I'll have some abilities for certain awards, but then it will be special awards and there will only be very few of them. These abilities would mainly be helping the team, not the person awarded with that medal (such as the Leadership aura).

SC2PL.Tamer wrote:

- Using a skill (or multiple skills) x amount of times throughout the game, that would grant you a [class] expertise medal

- Another version of that could be the number of skills used against a boss. Pretty much all classes have anti-boss specific skill (although I don't know much about the scout and assman...)
Good ideas, thought I will have to fight with how to implement this.
I've also thought about other things like
- Medics gain "medal points" for keeping the average health of the team high, treating injuries quickly.
- Scout maybe something with finding lots of items?
- Some medals could increase in chance if you kill bosses quickly?
- Successfully finishing missions increases change for medals.
- Teamkills remove the possibility to get any medals for the current game.

SC2PL.Tamer wrote:

- There could be special mentions (and bonuses too) for special accomplishments. For e.g. let's say you get a Meritorious Unit Commendation for finishing the game in normal mode, you could have a "With Merit" mention indicating you did it without dying a single time.
Could you elaborate on this? I don't really get what you mean with that.

SC2PL.Tamer wrote:

Actually, some medals could just be there to state your accomplishments and could accumulat indefinately. Of course, that would open the door to abuse by farming those medals so they probably would not provide any bonus whatsoever, but that would be frustrating for players though... maybe: provide very little bonuses (like, +5HP or +1% damage), so that it's not worth farming them
Maybe for basic awards like having a kill/hits ratio of 10 and finishing the game with it. (Was just naming a random number). These should be awards without bonuses, then, though. Even if you accumulate a couple of medals with 'only' +5Hp that would amount to quite a bit.

SC2PL.Tamer wrote:

Also, when dealing with a medal that can have many grades, you can simply add bars to that medal instead of having different medals. For e.g. I guess the medal of honor would be for finishing Hell or something. Your MoH with x bars would say you finished hell x+1 times!
Where/How would you want to have these bars displayed?
At the moment I planned three grades for most medals: Bronze, Silver, Gold.
The grade depends on the game difficulty and maybe on different factors.
E.g. some medal:
- You get Bronze when playing Normal with k/h ratio of at least 6.
- You get Silver when playing Nightmare with k/h ratio of at least 8.
- You get Gold when playing Hell with k/h ratio of at least 10.


SC2PL.Tamer wrote:

- Having higher ranks award medals, I think it would had a fun twist if Generals could give out medals themselves to other players in the game upon completion. Something like Bronze stars or so...
Bad idea. Would probably get abused. Generals could simply award everyone with a medal every game.
Even if you limit it to only one medal per game, that could still be abused.

SC2PL.Tamer wrote:

By the way, I'd be willing to draft a complete medal awards and requirements if you want to take that off your hands...
That'd be nice. Two minds working on something are usually better than just a single one.

SC2PL.Tamer wrote:

- Will the bank east of the river be accessible in b8?
It's relevant for a mission. Once this mission is added you'll be able to access it.

SC2PL.Tamer wrote:

- Is it even possible to survive so many raccoons?
No idea. Mr. Green
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PostSubject: Re: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Mon 10 Aug 2009, 04:01

SC2PL.Tamer wrote:
You know, binoculars don't work very well during night ^.^

That's why you use the night vision googles Razz

I mean, ok, the game evolves during the night, but there's still lighting in the street. Sure you won't be able to see very far, but it still would better "farther" than anyone else, that's the point Razz

I'm not sure how that could be imbalanced since I suggested having the safety trigger activated for this (which means he can not fire) and of course: it's not shared vision, like flares...


s3rius wrote:
SC2PL.Tamer wrote:

- There could be special mentions (and bonuses too) for special accomplishments. For e.g. let's say you get a Meritorious Unit Commendation for finishing the game in normal mode, you could have a "With Merit" mention indicating you did it without dying a single time.
Could you elaborate on this? I don't really get what you mean with that.

Well:

1- "Meritorious Unit Commendation" is a medal (a real one)
2- "With Merit" (could be anything else), is a suffix to the medal's name (does not exist for real) and it's optionnal
3- The suffix is there as nothing more than an accomplishment.

SC2PL.Tamer wrote:

Also, when dealing with a medal that can have many grades, you can simply add bars to that medal instead of having different medals. For e.g. I guess the medal of honor would be for finishing Hell or something. Your MoH with x bars would say you finished hell x+1 times!
Where/How would you want to have these bars displayed?

It would probably take too much space/time to have the bars displayed on the picture of the medal, it would simply appear as a different medal name you hit run the -medals command.

The bars are used by the UK for some medals, for e.g. the Victoria Cross with bar indicates the person received 2 Victoria Crosses, if he had received 3, it would be: Victoria Cross With Two Bars.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medal_bar

In the U.S. and Germany, they use Oak and Leaves for some medals.


s3rius wrote:
Bad idea. Would probably get abused. Generals could simply award everyone with a medal every game.
Even if you limit it to only one medal per game, that could still be abused.

Yeah, of course, if they could do it every game it would definately be abused. That's why:

1- You need to finish the game (complete last mission)
2- Have a general in the game you completed.

And yeah, I guess you could limit the number of medals awarded. But if these are medals you receive only once, then you can't really abuse that Razz
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PostSubject: Re: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Fri 14 Aug 2009, 01:04

What about invulnerable items?
So that noobs stop destroying the medkits on the floor =.= XD
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PostSubject: Re: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Fri 14 Aug 2009, 01:58

the main change I rly want is that wen u die by explosions, ur items dont get destroyed with u.
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PostSubject: Re: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Fri 14 Aug 2009, 04:43

A change I'd really like to see is having the FB useful in harder difficulty modes.

Right now I feel his Protection Matrix doesn't allow him to tank very much on nightmare and hell...they just hit too hard.

Also, the defense bonus aura is somehow useless imo, pretty much for the same reason imo => it's not a +5 or 6 armor that will help you to survive when you start to get overrun and have to take a few hits (or otherwise start running like everyone else and eventually get overrun for real).
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PostSubject: Re: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Fri 14 Aug 2009, 05:17

Cheesy-Gordia wrote:
the main change I rly want is that wen u die by explosions, ur items dont get destroyed with u.

That's not an issue with DotD, that's hard programed into WC3 that items are destroyable. Only way s3rius is going to resolve that issue is drastically increase the life of all items or make then invulnerable. But that's up to him, if he wants the extra work.
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PostSubject: Re: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Fri 14 Aug 2009, 05:20

Yeah the firebat is useful in normal, but fells very weak in nightmare (didn't try hell yet)
so his usefulness got greatly reduced....

....................
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PostSubject: Re: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Fri 14 Aug 2009, 07:21

The one thing i really want to see is a suit overload ability for incapacitated people. I really hate standing around waiting for someone to turn into a corpse before i can evac them.

You can have the ability expend the remaining hp of the incap soldier to either heal nearby allies hp/mana or damage zombies (or hell, both). Would be nice if it slowed nearby zombies like the EMP too. This would really help balance out the new difficulty a little bit, seeing as how easy it is to be over run.

Basically the dieing soldier is sacrificing himself to save his team mates in some way. Maybe change up the ability depending on the class (Medic overload heals team mates, demo adds napalm and does a lot of damage, fb same thing, scout/engineer slows enemies, etc.).
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PostSubject: Re: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Sun 16 Aug 2009, 21:59

I've found the city map to be a pretty useless item, it's like a 1 use flare gun with unlimited range

but what in the game requires you to actually see something that is on the other side of the map? I really can't find anything to answer that question...

and since it's rare item, I would suggest making it a permanent item (just like the crystal ball) with a big cooldown (like 1 or 2 minutes)


while I'm talking about items, is it possible to have certain areas of the map not drop items at all? places that are not, or hardly accessible like the current east bank of the river, the train's tracks, forest, etc. (I've actually found items in the middle of a burned down forest...how the fuck are we supposed to get them otherwise? note: it took a long time to get there and we were 2 FBs doing just that, burning trees)
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PostSubject: Re: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Mon 17 Aug 2009, 09:29

BurnCruise wrote:
The one thing i really want to see is a suit overload ability for incapacitated people. I really hate standing around waiting for someone to turn into a corpse before i can evac them.

You can have the ability expend the remaining hp of the incap soldier to either heal nearby allies hp/mana or damage zombies (or hell, both). Would be nice if it slowed nearby zombies like the EMP too. This would really help balance out the new difficulty a little bit, seeing as how easy it is to be over run.

Basically the dieing soldier is sacrificing himself to save his team mates in some way. Maybe change up the ability depending on the class (Medic overload heals team mates, demo adds napalm and does a lot of damage, fb same thing, scout/engineer slows enemies, etc.).

= perk similar to one in cod 4 where when you die yuo drop a nade?


and i kinda agree with tamer.... well it wille be useful to search map for items or search for dogs when that dog bug happens Very Happy
lol imagine like sar or something like that spawning inside those areas

a rare nv goggle item on dark missions would be good Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Sun 23 Aug 2009, 15:17

Ammo modifiers for Firebat, I mean fuel modifiers!
1. Level 2 modifier: Black Napalm: Modifies the flamethrower to shoot out a more potent napalm, which is jet-black with streaks of purple. The effects are the same as normal napalm, but is even more deadly, giving slightly increased range, initial weapons damage, and damage over time.
2. Level 3 modifier: Liquid Tiberium: Modifies the flamethrower to shoot out a sickly-radioactive green stream of Liquid Tiberium, which is HIGHLY poisonous, slowing enemy movement speed and causing damage over time.
3. Level 3 modifier: Liquid Nitrogen: Modifies the flamethrower to shoot out an icey-blue stream of Liquid Nitrogen, slowing enemy movement speed, causing damage over time, and there is also the slight chance of an enemy being FROZEN SOLID for a few seconds.(Enemy is encased inside a Frost Nova for several seconds)
4. Level 4 modifier: Liquid Antivirus: Modifies the flamethrower to shoot out a stream of Liquid Antivirus, which is the BANE of all zombies everywhere. The Liquid Antivirus actively and very aggressively counteracts the zombie virus, causing the undead's bodies to rapidly disintegrate and fall apart. Adds a substantial amount of initial damage, and adds a slight range bonus. Color of the liquid is undecided as of now.
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PostSubject: Re: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Mon 24 Aug 2009, 15:55

New Side Mission(s)
I realized that the police station wasn't being used, but there are jail cells so here's a new idea. Whenever someone visits the police station, they should search of all the cells for a lone police officer who jailed himself to keep safe. The cell is randomly picked everytime, so this mission isn't as easy as it seems. In all of the other cells however, are former prisoners turned into zombies. These people were taken into police custody because of their weird, erratic and dangerous behavior before the initial zombie outbreak. Now however, these people are but husks of their former selves, mindless shambling rotting and festering walking corpses. You should go to each cell and put these people out of their misery. When you do find the police officer, you must release him from his cell by activating or int his case, shooting a doodad lever found in the police station. When he is freed, he gives you the police station armory key, which allows you to open the police station's armory to take whatever supplies may be there. For putting the people out of their misery and for freeing this police officer, you get say.. 10xp? The police officer follow whoever freed them, it'd be wise for you to bring him to Sgt. Madigan and the others, or maybe he can just follow you around for extra firepower. If he's evacuated by helicopter however, he gives you some more xp because he counts as a civilian. One last thing, when the police officer is freed he informs you that he was waiting for a shipment of supplies but it never came in, the armored supply truck was probably mauled by a zombie horde, as were the occupants of the vehicle. The armored supply truck contains supplies and spawns at a completely random location everytime. However in order to access the supplies the dog tags of the deceased driver, guards of the truck, etc must be uploaded and then you will find another key, which will open the truck up so that you can get some more supplies. Don't worry though, the vehicle's occupants aren't far from the vehicle itself, their corpses are laying around the truck. This is the 2nd and last part of the mini-quest chain, and this part gives + 5xp, along with whatever supplies were in it.
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PostSubject: Re: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Mon 24 Aug 2009, 16:06

I like that side mission idea and the FB usefullness later game idea.

Would be nice to use my beloved Firebat again.
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PostSubject: Re: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Tue 25 Aug 2009, 14:08

4.H-Pestilence- wrote:
.... bla bla ..
4.H-Pestilence- wrote:
.... bla bla ..
You know that your ideas are freaking hawt?
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PostSubject: Re: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Tue 25 Aug 2009, 16:31

Quote :
s3rius:"You know that your ideas are freaking hawt?"
I also know that my body is pretty hawt.
Heres some new ideas that are sorta minor:
Improved First Aid Kits(IFAKs): Heals more damage than regular FAKs(First Aid Kits) and also cures bleeding.
Advanced Antidotes(AdvAnts:) Heals slightly more health, and provides immunity to infection for a short time, or gives some ailment resistance to disease.
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PostSubject: Re: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Tue 25 Aug 2009, 18:31

4.H-Pestilence- wrote:

Advanced Antidotes(AdvAnts:) Heals slightly more health, and provides immunity to infection for a short time, or gives some ailment resistance to disease.

that's a nice attempt at making antidotes useful Razz
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PostSubject: Re: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Tue 01 Sep 2009, 05:19

Nice idea the police station one. Always didnt understand why those cells, just destroyed them and took away everything i saw in there xD

----------------

hmmm ideas:

New items:

* Deployable mg?: like a sentry but which demands the player to stay still?
* Pistols?: to have them as a 2ndary and common weapon in invt (and i mean really common)
* NV googles: Increases LOS of unit who carries it.
* Survival Gear: New Armor (6?) + Hp regen (1 hpps?)
* Hand grenades? like afterlife. REALLY USEFULL >_<


New units:

* Already posted my idea of field surgeon medic
* I would also like to see a class based on the MAC weapon. Like the assman is based on the shotty.
* I have an idea of a "cover ops" unit. Im still trying to improve it, will post it later.


Thats for now, g2 play xD ill post something more later XD
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PostSubject: Re: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Thu 10 Sep 2009, 18:11

Work is progressing slow as ever, but I do actually have something new to show:


The screen shots are already slightly outdated, but show a new area that will be accessible in the next beta. The garbage disposal plant. The plant is located in the north east (north of the graveyard, east of the science lab). It will feature two working conveyors and economy-friendly garbage disposal for the whole family.
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PiscisKnight

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PostSubject: Re: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Thu 10 Sep 2009, 21:32

gj serius! ^^ keep updating us ^^
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PostSubject: Re: (08/2009 - 10/2009 ) General Discussions [Closed]   Thu 10 Sep 2009, 21:53

Economy friendly lol... Nothing says family like a giant flame Very Happy hahaha
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